Re: [unrev-II] More on MS and open source

From: Grant Bowman (
Date: Wed Sep 05 2001 - 13:44:00 PDT

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    * Jack Park <> [010905 12:29]:
    > At 02:13 PM 9/5/2001 -0400, you wrote:
    > >Very good story! It brings up a couple of thoughts:
    > >
    > >1. What about Ximian & OHS?
    > I picked up a flier on Ximian at LinuxWorld last week. Didn't take much
    > time to study it because I had just come from watching a demo of Open
    > Office (Star Office, open source) and was completely captivated by what I
    > saw. I have been saying for a while that it may well be that OHS is simply
    > a substrate on which some future version of Open Office and Mozilla browser
    > play major user interface roles. is the open source project. Sun is both supporting this
    effort and going to release a version 6 of "StarOffice."

    There is a groupware discussion group working with OpenOffice. I have
    been on the mail list for awhile. More info at:

    The discussion has gone around and around, however there seems to be
    consensus that phpGroupware is the best server backend for whatever kind
    of client that "should" be rolled into OpenOffice. There was discussion
    of using other open source clients in addition to Mozilla, but it
    doesn't look like the calendaring functions present in StarOffice 5.2
    are going to make it into OpenOffice, at least in the first release,
    which is disappointing. They need some programming muscle to move this
    forward and seem to be still organizing their strategy.

    More info on phpGroupware, the only present implementation of the Open
    Groupware Standards (OGS) can be found at:


    The guy running phpGroupware is named Dan Kuykendall
    <>. I talked to him on the phone awhile back and
    introduced him to some of Doug's work and the related activites. He's
    excited about the prospects but is more interested in coding than
    talking right now. He also has a new job he's settling into. Dan had
    discussions with Migel about Evolution and the interplay between
    phpGroupware and the OGS protocols.

    I think the OGS protocols are complementary to Nodal but the approaches
    are a bit different. OGS tries to XML-ize existing standards rather
    than create something entirely new.

    > On another tack, I'm not sure we can completely ignore the .NET issue; MS
    > has 30 billion bucks in the bank and one way or another, I suspect we will
    > have to live with .NET -- perhaps seeing an end to DCOM, who knows...
    > So, open source variants of the .NET system might be important in the future.

    Ximian got some press for working -with- Microsoft on their version
    called Mono. I remember reading about at least one other seperate
    effort in the Linux Weekly News a few weeks ago.

    > >2. What can our e-journal do to enhance public computer literacy?
    > >Particularly make people comfortable with open-source OS.
    > [...]
    > >3. Which Linux desktop is from De Icaza?
    > Isn't it called Gnome?

    Yes, GNU Network Object Model Environment. Miguel is also behind
    Evolution, the Outlook killer of the open source world. Evolution
    should be released by the end of the year finally. I look forward to
    switching from mutt and hope all the features I use are in Evolution as
    well. I did play with it and it's very a very nice piece of software.
    Doug and I actually ran into some of the Evolution folks and talked over
    pizza a few months ago.

    > It was built because the K-Desktop used a
    > proprietary widget system and Gnome started completely open source. A
    > trend I am watching is one centered around the idea that widgets built for
    > K work interchangeably with Gnome, and vice versa. Without that, Linux
    > looses big time.
    > [...]

    The KDE folks have already created this, I forget the name of it. SuSE
    is a very strong KDE platform. Several of the KDE developers are on
    staff, at least they used to be!

    > >I would particularly like to see a discussion around Item 2. Maybe after a
    > >bit of rambling and wrong tacks, we can develop a viable plan. That
    > >plan ought include some assessment of what the "curriculum" for public
    > >computency should include.
    > >
    > >One testimony to the lack of this "human system - tool system
    > >co-evolution" is that a huge number of people are buying new computers simply
    > >because they are afraid to try "upgrading" an operating system. Computer
    > >manufacturers love new OS versions for that reason. But it says
    > >something about our society.
    > >
    > >Henry

    I think it says more about the complexity of the OSes people use and the
    amount of QA that goes into the upgrade process for each OS. It's also
    cheaper to just get a new box and alot simplier due to the economies of
    scale involved.


    -- Grant Bowman                                   <>

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