Say, yeah!-- Especially that part about having a place to argue. :__))
It sounds to me like a combination of Traction categories and Topic
Maps get you pretty far down the road -- but tacking on such stuff
to a think written in Php is the problem...
Jack Park wrote:
> Well, it had to happen. I've been musing about implementing something
> the Nexist theme that tries to learn as much as possible from my
> experiences playing with Lucid Fried Eggs at http://www.memes.net
> What follows is perhaps longish (sorry), perhaps nonlinear (not
> sorry), and
> nonetheless the result of a flash of insight.
> What's fun with Lucid:
> 1- The personal portal-like feel and user (my) experience
> 2- The reminders of what's been recently touched -- much like a neural
> 3- The statistics showing what's most active
> 4- The BLOG-like interface
> 5- The Wiki-like interface
> What's missing with Lucid (my opinions only):
> 1- The ability to generate varying views (explained below)
> 2- The ability to construct threads (in a manner about which I am
> Why do I care about what's missing?
> 1- Because I'd like to snap a topic map views (which is partially
> by way of TouchGraph) on threads (see 2)
> 2- Because I'd like to be able to have IBIS-like discussions going on
> over the Lucid network, without, say, having some particular IBIS-like
> page at the a portal such as memes.net.
> How might I go about implementing what's missing?
> I am completely convinced that Lucid could be enhanced in the manner I
> thinking. I would be glad to discuss such enhancements, but, I am also
> convinced that I am not a PHP programmer; I'm inclined to roam about
> looking for various components already existing in Java and patching
> together. For instance, there exist a couple of open source Java Wiki
> implementations that are, at once, simple and elegant, and capable of
> mutating (excuse me: evolving under facilitation) in the desired
> What then?
> Each entry (as made by a user typing into the input text box) in a
> page (Node) is, itself, an individual cell which can/should take on
> properties not presently visible in Lucid. Consider the ability to
> contextual links within each cell. A contextual link can be thought
> of as
> actually a cluster of links each associated with some context. Here
> what I am thinking. I have often thought that the real meaning of
> any data, lies in that which we make of that data. It would be nice
> have a tiny cell associated with some chunk of data (another cell)
> that, in
> effect, is labeled "Kilroy was here" and which, when opened, has some
> comments by Kilroy related to Kilroy's experiences with that data.
> the cell created by Kilroy is actually another cell somewhere else in
> Lucid network. That cell would, of course, hyperlink to the cell for
> it lends meaning.
> Now, suppose that Kilroy was actually lending a pro or con argument
> respect to the particular cell. And, the particular cell was, itself,
> lending an idea, question, or argument to some other cell (to which it
> would hyperlink). Now, all over a Lucid network, we have the basis of
> Mapped Dialog.
> How might such a network be organized? An easy way to imagine this is
> Kilroy has his own Node, which, itself, is a container for as many of
> cells as he wishes to contribute. With that arrangement, I now have
> ability to rapidly gain a view of Kilroy's contributions. Of course,
> don't have to organize an entire network that way. I can just let the
> topic map engine (that, of course, is a part of the new system) pop me
> view of Kilroy. By way of that very same topic map engine, perhaps
> TouchGraph as a visual presentation system, I can pop a view of the
> Dialog or any part of it as well.
> Why do all this?
> Simply because I am looking for the fastest way to prototype a DKR
> parts of a HyperScope included. This one seems easy. The entire
> maintained by Lucid now is a great start at a DKR. My inclinations
> are to
> render it navigable in a variety of ways. I still like the "most
> and "most talked about" views, and I would like the threaded views I
> suggesting as well. With those, Lucid grows into a powerful Dialog
> tool while still maintaining its character as a public white board for
> musings, news, and so forth. Given that, you have a much more
> powerful way
> to allow for spontaneous eruption of argument, and a way to focus and
> control that argument as it progresses. Much more powerful, that is,
> are the slashCode-like interfaces that just allow for random, though
> potentially hierarchical organization of comments, made without regard
> any rules of engagement.
> Dialog Mapping, by the way, is envisioned to be implemented in two
> different fashions: there's always the spontaneous discussions, now
> cleaner by the linking facilities, and there's also envisioned a
> (facilitated) system where someone can "own" a discussion and perform
> amount of facilitating (censoring, classifying, etc) of contributions.
> And, as you might guess, I'd like to experiment with a text mining
> on all that information that allows for the potential discovery of
> not noticed by the humans in the loop.
> Where might one go next?
> This, for me, is the fun part. Imagine a Knowledge Portal that also
> as my own BLOG, as my own (private) email system, and as my favorite
> to satisfy my need to argue with Eric about all sorts of things.
> Lucid is
> close. Now, I can imagine dropping all these email lists because they
> all be easily available to me such that I can subscribe to headlines
> to be
> presented at my own "homepage" at the portal, where I would otherwise
> with my email, and respond to the headlines (including entering mapped
> In the system I am envisioning here, I can imagine a strong
> system that allows me to deal with my own email privately from
> anywhere in
> the world where web browsing is available, a personal WebLog (BLOG) in
> which I can do the sort of musing I am presently doing, but available
> everyone, not just those who chance to search the bootstrap.org web
> and which allows for automatic linkage with the BLOGs of all the other
> participants at this portal, regardless of their focus of interest.
> how many times some of us forward interesting posts from other email
> to this list (and vice versa). You may not agree with me now, but I
> to think that email lists balkanize human experience. Recent events
> if as never before, that balkanized human experience means big
> The architecture I am proposing draws heavily from some truly creative
> work, including Lucid Fried Eggs, the many Wiki implementations, email
> we presently use it, and the many comments by Douglas Engelbart that
> argued for the "many views" HyperScope coupled to a DKR.
> For me, this one seems easy to prototype. I arrive with this
> intuition by
> way of playing with memes.net, which, in my opinion, is strongly
> that an OHS mantra should be to "implement early, revise often." I
> think it's nearly as easy to flash ideas like this in the absence of
> personal experience with well-made tools.
> There are, to be sure, many other architectures available for
> and implementation.
> Say what?
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This archive was generated by hypermail 2.0.0 : Mon Sep 24 2001 - 19:41:13 PDT